Screams & Social Justice: Analyzing the Politics of Horror
On this Representation in Cinema podcast episode, we delve into the intricate relationship between horror films and social justice, featuring a discussion with Professor Kathy Simon, who has developed an online course entitled "Screams and Social Justice: Analyzing the Politics of Horror," that you can now enroll in. Central to our discourse is the assertion that horror serves not merely as entertainment but also as a profound reflection of societal anxieties and cultural narratives, particularly those relevant to Black, Brown, and Indigenous communities. Throughout the episode, we explore various thematic elements present in horror cinema, including class, gender, and the role of technology, while emphasizing the necessity for more nuanced and complex portrayals of characters within the genre. Furthermore, we highlight the significance of community engagement and ongoing dialogue regarding these critical issues as participants share their insights and reflections on the films discussed. Ultimately, this episode aims to illuminate the power of horror as a vehicle for social commentary, encouraging listeners to engage deeply with the narratives that shape our understanding of contemporary societal challenges.
Takeaways:
- The podcast episode emphasizes the importance of representation in cinema, particularly focusing on black, brown, and indigenous peoples' narratives.
- The discussion highlights the new online course titled 'Screams and Social Justice', which analyzes the intersection of horror films and social issues.
- Listeners are encouraged to participate in upcoming screenings that engage with themes of black culture, community building, and black women's protection.
- The hosts explore how horror films can serve as a commentary on societal fears and anxieties, reflecting broader cultural messages.
- The episode discusses the significance of complex character portrayals in horror films, advocating for deeper representations of black characters.
- Kathy Simon's course aims to equip students with tools to critically analyze horror films and create their own scripts reflecting contemporary social issues.
Links referenced in this episode:
- Course information and link: https://kathy-simon-s-school.teachable.com/p/screams-social-justice-analyzing-the-politics-of-horror
- Our Voices Project website: ourvoicesproject.com
- Want to be on the podcast? Send us an email at inforvoicesproject.com
- Join us at one of our screenings of Being Black in America and register for FREE here: bit.ly/bbia
For any questions about the course, you can contact Kathy at thehorrorprof@gmail.com.
Mentioned in this episode:
Behind the Glass
Podcast and gallery focusing on underrepresented artists utilize the space to amplify their work. Curated by @Richardbcolon @qua.jay. Check out the podcast or join them in person first Fridays at 240 E Main St, Rochester, NY! https://behind-the-glass-gallery.captivate.fm
Our Voices Project - Land Acknowledgement
Transcript
Hello listeners, it's Jackie McGriff, your host for today's episode of Representation in Cinema, a podcast that dives deep into films focused on black, brown and indigenous peoples.
Speaker A:Now, before we get into today's episode, we want to remind folks that you can listen to previous episodes wherever you listen to your favorite podcast.
Speaker A:Because of course, we're your favorite podcast.
Speaker A:You can also list or you can also learn about our films on our website@ourvoicesproject.com if you'd like to be a guest on our podcast, you can email us@inforvoicesproject.com and please note that while we welcome all, we prioritize hearing from black, brown and indigenous folks.
Speaker A:So right now we're in the middle of our Being Black in America screenings in Rochester.
Speaker A:We've been loving the conversations thus far and we're looking forward to more.
Speaker A:On Saturdays, November 8th and the 15th, we will be screening our film in the same place that we actually shot the film, Coco Ray David's Studio Da Per.
Speaker A:On the 8th, we'll be talking about preserving black culture and building community.
Speaker A:And on the 15th, we'll be talking about protecting black women.
Speaker A:On December 11th, we'll be at the Legacy Drama House.
Speaker A:Our topic will then be about black capitalism.
Speaker A:So if you want to be there for any of those conversations, definitely pull up to be there for those talks.
Speaker A:Make sure you go to Bit Lybia to sign up.
Speaker A:It's free and open to the public.
Speaker A:ASL interpretation will be provided and we're actually working on making it hybrid.
Speaker A:So if you are not in the Rochester area or you're unable to come to the screenings in person, we are working on that.
Speaker A:So make sure you are subscribed to our YouTube, you are following our social media pages, or if you're signed up for our newsletter, you'll get those updates to know when that will be available.
Speaker A:And again, to register for free, you can sign up at Bit Ly Bbia.
Speaker A:Now, by the time we're recording this, tomorrow will be Halloween.
Speaker A:And as you know, it is.
Speaker A:That's, of course, spooky season and that is the best time of the year.
Speaker A:Christmas fans, argue with your mama.
Speaker A:I'm.
Speaker A:That is the hill that I'm going to.
Speaker A:That's.
Speaker A:That's the hill that I am willing to die on.
Speaker A:Unless, of course, you want to say that Juneteenth is the best time of the year, then I will not.
Speaker A:I will not argue with you there.
Speaker A:That is arguably also another great time of the year, but otherwise it's Halloween, y'.
Speaker B:All.
Speaker A:So today's episode is about horror films.
Speaker A:In the spirit of the best time of the year.
Speaker A:Again, I'm gonna continue to say that.
Speaker A:And it's specifically about an online course called Screams and Social justice, analyzing the politics of horror.
Speaker A:It's a seven week course offered by Kathy Simon, who.
Speaker A:Who is joining us on the podcast virtually.
Speaker A:Welcome to the podcast, Kathy.
Speaker B:Hi.
Speaker B:So happy to be here.
Speaker B:Excited to have this conversation and give people some good information about the course.
Speaker B:And just this conversation in general, I think that's so important to talk about.
Speaker A:Yeah, absolutely excited to talk about this.
Speaker A:And I've been excited ever since I saw you post in the.
Speaker A:So it was the black alternative Facebook group.
Speaker A:It's like a, it's a group of like over 15,000 people.
Speaker A:I think anyone who identifies as black alternative.
Speaker A:And yeah, you'd posted about the, about the course and I was like, I have to talk to her immediately on the podcast.
Speaker A:Kathy Simon is a licensed independent clinical social worker and associate professor of psychology and community mental health.
Speaker A:Professor Kathy created this online course, Screams and Social justice, analyzing the politics of horror to bring together her passion for teaching with her love of the horror genre.
Speaker A:Professor Simon's goal is to give students the tools to not only appreciate horror as entertainment, but to also unpack its cultural messages, question its assumptions, and see how it speaks to broader issues in our lives today.
Speaker A:So, Kathy, with all that being said, please give us a breakdown of this course.
Speaker A:You know, what does the week cover just really break it down for us?
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker B:So seven weeks and each week has its own particular topic.
Speaker B:So the first week we are just talking about what is horror.
Speaker B:So any conversation I have, I like to make sure we're defining what we're talking about.
Speaker B:So just talking about what is horror, what scares us, why do we watch these movies, all of that, and then also think about what are social politics because that's framing everything that comes after that.
Speaker B:So the first week is just that overview and then after that we have a week about class and consumerism and then we go into monsters and otherness.
Speaker B:We will go over global horror and understanding what's going on for other cultures and the movies that they're kind of experiencing at different, different points in time.
Speaker B:Horror as a social mirror is another week.
Speaker B:Gender and sexuality in horror and then technology.
Speaker B:Horror, which is really interesting with, especially with all of the AI and the different things that we have going on now, seeing the movies coming out and how it's reflecting what our anxieties are about technology and it's the use of technology.
Speaker B:So I think that's going to be a really interesting week.
Speaker B:So every week there will be an assignment to complete.
Speaker B:So really thoughtful assignments and maybe even thinking about, like, what was the first time you remember being scared by a horror movie?
Speaker B:What horror movie was it?
Speaker B:And then if you go think back now, what social messages were in that horror movie that you probably didn't even realize?
Speaker B:So going back and looking at the movies that you maybe loved maybe a long time ago or maybe recently, and just looking at it from a new lens.
Speaker B:So my goal for those who are watching, watching the movies as we're, you know, engaging in the course is that they re watch it.
Speaker B:So even if you've seen it a thousand times, and I will do the same.
Speaker B:I will rewatch these movies as we're going through it and really look at it from this particular lens.
Speaker B:And I think that's going to be really helpful.
Speaker B:So each week there will be a thoughtful assignment, there will be some discussion questions, there will be recommended movies to watch as part of whatever the topic is for each week.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker B:Yeah, and then, and then that's it.
Speaker B:And then we can go to the discussion board and just have really great conversations.
Speaker B:People can post their assignments there, get feedback from other people.
Speaker B:And one thing that I forgot to say is that the culmination of the course is for people to come up with their own script of a horror movie.
Speaker B:So they will pick a social issue that we are dealing with now and they will create a script for horror movie that's reflecting that.
Speaker B:So it can be something that's very direct.
Speaker B:Like, you know, something like even.
Speaker B:Well, even get out was kind of, you know, direct, but it still had like a really cool, interesting way of doing what it did.
Speaker B:So it could be very direct, it could be indirect, it could be body horror.
Speaker B:But taking a social issue today, and they will create their own script for that and then that can go in the discussion board and we can just talk about everyone's ideas.
Speaker B:So I am so excited about this.
Speaker B:Yeah, super excited.
Speaker B:So that's about how it goes week to week.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:Right now, if you're either listening or if you're watching this and you decide to join this course, which you absolutely should, and you create a.
Speaker A:You create a script.
Speaker A:Hello.
Speaker A:Hi, I'm your next director, please.
Speaker A:There we go.
Speaker A:For real.
Speaker A:Like if you.
Speaker A:Thank you.
Speaker A:Like, let's, let's create like horror films.
Speaker A:I am, I am so serious, actually about this.
Speaker B:Who knows?
Speaker B:We can come from this.
Speaker B:I mean, if people Think about.
Speaker B:People could then take that and use all that information and that script and do something really cool with it.
Speaker B:I would love that.
Speaker B:Because I don't.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:Anything that I do when it comes to teaching, I don't want it to just be.
Speaker B:We have these conversations and boom, you walk out of the class, you walk out of the online course and you're done.
Speaker B:We're meant to continue these conversations so people continue that into making movies.
Speaker B:That would be incredible.
Speaker B:That would be amazing.
Speaker B:And spreading the message even further.
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker B:That would be great.
Speaker A:Exactly.
Speaker A:Because I think.
Speaker A:And that's what we like to do with our films as well, is like, we don't just want, like, we obviously want you to come and see it.
Speaker A:And, you know, we want.
Speaker A:We.
Speaker A:We also want to be able to talk about it.
Speaker A:I feel as though, you know, the.
Speaker A:The films that make the most impact, you immediately, like after, when this.
Speaker A:When the credits are rolling, you immediately want to get in a conversation and, you know, and it should be something that's like an ongoing thing, like something.
Speaker A:And I know this is not a.
Speaker A:Of a horror film, but with.
Speaker A:I mean, I'm still having conversations with people about the ending of Inception.
Speaker A:People are still arguing about, you know, like, whether the top is still spitting or not, you know, and so.
Speaker A:But those.
Speaker A:That.
Speaker A:That's.
Speaker A:That's what's exciting.
Speaker B:That's exactly it.
Speaker B:Right?
Speaker A:Yes, yes.
Speaker A:And horror, I feel like, is like one of those genres where a lot of people, and I feel like a lot of films as well, are very surface level, but there are also so many horror films where there's a deeper meaning.
Speaker A:There.
Speaker A:There's a.
Speaker A:There's there's room for a deeper discussion, especially when it's making social commentary, you know, about.
Speaker A:About things that are happening, you know, in our world.
Speaker A:You know, whether it has to do with race, class, gender, like all these different things that are really important discussions, but, you know, you're putting it into a horror film and there's just so much more.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:That you can, like, talk about, you know, and the way in which, you know, this was talked about in the film, the way that it plays out on film.
Speaker A:So, yeah, I think that's very important.
Speaker A:So, Kathy, what was your motivation for starting this course?
Speaker B:Right, so I think back to.
Speaker B:So Jordan Peele comes, comes out with Get Out.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Very exciting time.
Speaker B:That was amazing movie.
Speaker B:So good to see, you know, these issues being talked about in that way, blending the horror with reality.
Speaker B:I mean, just an incredible mov movie.
Speaker B:But what I started to notice around that time, you know, he had that movie, then he had us and all that.
Speaker B:So there were some discussions because I'm in a lot of horror communities online and there were some discussions about how horror is going.
Speaker B:Woke now, that idea of that.
Speaker B:And I maybe too much was kind of stepping into the conversation.
Speaker B:And I would always say, you know, horror has always been political.
Speaker B:If you have not noticed that, you are not paying attention.
Speaker B:If we think about like even slasher movies going to like, you know, slasher movies first came about and that whole idea that, you know, the virgin survives and those who have sexual activity engage in that are the ones to die, where do we think those that comes from, those are certain values that are being represented in that in a slasher movie.
Speaker B:Of course now it's gone off and it's, you know, doing lots of different things, but that's where that started that whole idea.
Speaker B:So everything, it's representing a moment in time.
Speaker B:You think about the birth of that.
Speaker B:So I think.
Speaker B:Right, exactly.
Speaker B:For people not even realizing how much what we're afraid of as a culture, those particular values that has been in horror for, for so many years.
Speaker B:We think about when people were afraid of, you know, like, I think about like radiation and different things like that and all those things.
Speaker B:That's when we had all of those gigantic ants and creatures and things like that because we were afraid of where that would go and what that would look like.
Speaker B:So that's representing that.
Speaker B:So it's always reflected the social political climate at any given time.
Speaker B:So I think, Jessica, helping people today to understand that there's nothing new.
Speaker B:There's nothing new in terms of that, you know, that connection to horror.
Speaker B:Horror has always been that if you're paying attention.
Speaker A:Right, it has, absolutely.
Speaker A:So that actually gets us into our next question because I have to know what the films are that you are recommending that folks watch for, you know, a deeper meaning.
Speaker A:And, and also too, I would love to know, you know, as you talk about these films, you know, why, why include them like in the course and maybe, and maybe there's some that you also want to talk about that or at least reference, you know, that may not be in, in the curriculum.
Speaker A:Right, I know there's.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker A:So many, but yeah, let us, let us know what are the, the films that you recommend?
Speaker B:There's so many, so I kind of picked a couple to kind of think about.
Speaker B:So get out obviously being one of them.
Speaker B:I think that's a great one.
Speaker B:Let's see.
Speaker B:So then we have people under the stairs, which is a great classic classic movie.
Speaker B:So thinking about that movie, which has, you know, all of the, like, elements.
Speaker B:You know, the kids who are under the stairs and, you know, these terrible parents.
Speaker B:But there's a whole class issue there.
Speaker B:So part of the background of the story is that those people, you know, mother and father, whoever, you know, those characters were who were, you know, putting their children into the basement and doing all those terrible things.
Speaker B:They were landlords.
Speaker B:They were landlords who were buying up property in particular areas and then.
Speaker B:And then evicting people.
Speaker B:So that's the whole reason why the movie started, is that fool was getting evicted because of the landlord.
Speaker B:So that.
Speaker B:And then they.
Speaker B:Right, that's exactly.
Speaker B:So it's.
Speaker B:There's class right there.
Speaker B:And that's what we see in, like, gentrification and all of these different things that people like.
Speaker B:If you're not right, if you don't really think about it, you just think, oh, it's a creepy movie.
Speaker B:But no, it's something very, very important.
Speaker B:And then I love.
Speaker B:At the end, you know, the house blows up and all the money is raining over the community, and they're just kind of there, like, singing and dancing with all the money.
Speaker B:So it's just like.
Speaker B:It's just.
Speaker B:It's really fun because it's telling us a really important story.
Speaker B:It's very, very creepy.
Speaker B:And then I like that at the end, there is, like, that change in power in terms of at least that, you know, entity of, you know, corruption kind of being taken care of.
Speaker B:So that would be a classic example of how much we don't realize that there's lots of messages in all of these movies.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So that's one example.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Thinking of others would be, like, even something like the substance.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:That recently came out.
Speaker B:So that would be one recommendation.
Speaker B:When we think about gender, and I really think about the pressures for women, not just women who are celebrities, but the pressure for women in general in terms of aging and the lengths that people will go through to remain young.
Speaker B:I mean, literally, we saw.
Speaker B:If you see the movie, I won't give away any spoilers, but the lengths that she went through to keep her youth because she wasn't taken as seriously in her, you know, in her fields anymore because she was aging.
Speaker B:So that's.
Speaker B:So that's.
Speaker B:That's a intense body horror movie.
Speaker B:But a body horror is often used to kind of talk about a lot of these issues.
Speaker B:But there's a great example there of gender and the expectations that we have.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:I mean, I'll Okay, I. I will give a. I'll give a little spoilers because we.
Speaker A:And we'll.
Speaker A:We'll put up.
Speaker A:We'll put up a warning.
Speaker A:So if you haven't watched the Substance.
Speaker A:Okay, please just don't skip.
Speaker A:Skip ahead a little bit.
Speaker A:Okay, but like, with the, with the substance, there's one scene in particular that I.
Speaker A:Every time I'm like, this is the crux of what this film is about where she's getting ready to go out on this date.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:And she keeps looking at herself in the mirror.
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker A:And our producer Chris is shaking his head just like, oh, my God.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:But she.
Speaker A:So she keeps looking in the mirror and then keeps going back to, like, fix some part of her face that she feels needs.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Fixing.
Speaker A:And then you think that she's getting ready to leave again.
Speaker A:And then she keeps seeing herself in the mirror and she just hates what she's seeing in the mirror.
Speaker A:And then she doesn't end up leaving.
Speaker A:And I remember being in a theater just, like, wanting to scream like, you look amazing.
Speaker A:Like, what are you talking?
Speaker A:Like, you look drop dead gorgeous.
Speaker A:What.
Speaker A:What is this?
Speaker A:Like, hang up.
Speaker A:And you just feel so bad for her.
Speaker A:Like, you feel so much for her because you're like, oh, like, I wish I could just be there and just, like, talk her.
Speaker A:Yeah, like, because I'm like, you are keeping yourself from, like, first of all, like, you're.
Speaker A:You don't accept yourself.
Speaker A:Like, I mean, that's clear.
Speaker A:And then.
Speaker A:But there's also that thing of, like, you're letting that also, like, your feelings about how you look.
Speaker A:Keep yourself from potentially having a good time and potentially, like, finding happiness and love and, like, and there's just so much that's there.
Speaker A:And I'm like, it's.
Speaker A:We're watching a body horror film.
Speaker A:But there's so much that's being said right now in this.
Speaker A:In this moment.
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker B:And then we think about all the pressures around social media and, you know, how people, you know, are, you know, manipulating their.
Speaker B:The images that they're posting and things like that.
Speaker B:Like, the pressure that people are feeling right now is incredibly intense.
Speaker B:So that's realistic, completely realistic for how people experience the world right now.
Speaker B:So just.
Speaker B:It's sad.
Speaker B:It's sad and scary.
Speaker B:I mean, which is what the movie was meant to be to a degree.
Speaker B:Yeah, exactly.
Speaker A:Yeah, exactly.
Speaker A:Any other examples?
Speaker B:Let's see.
Speaker B:We could also talk about something like Tales from the Hood, which is comedy.
Speaker B:So thinking about how comedy kind of talks about these things, but I know Tales from the Hood does a really good job of talking about issues, particularly in the black community and certain things, and really kind of putting that horror lens on it, but also infusing the comedy in it.
Speaker B:So that's a really nice mix of it.
Speaker B:So, again, you could watch it and think, oh, that's just like a silly anthology horror series.
Speaker B:But there's really more to it.
Speaker B:Again, if you're paying good attention to the stories that it's telling, it's highlighting the issues that people go through.
Speaker B:So I think there's just so many.
Speaker B:I think.
Speaker B:I. I don't know.
Speaker B:It's hard to even think about one where there isn't a message.
Speaker B:Honestly, there is, like.
Speaker A:Yes, well, when you mentioned Tales from the Hood, I think you were talking about, like, mixing the.
Speaker A:The horror with the comedy as well.
Speaker A:I think a recent.
Speaker A:A more recent film.
Speaker A:I really enjoyed this film, the Blackening.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Thank you.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:Thank you.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:Which is now on Netflix.
Speaker A:Please go watch it.
Speaker A:Yeah, but it.
Speaker A:It's seriously like it.
Speaker A:Because I just think about how much us, as black people, we are really unserious people.
Speaker A:And so it's like.
Speaker B:It's like it's really represented.
Speaker B:We're talking about representation.
Speaker B:It really represented that.
Speaker A:Because I was just like, here we are.
Speaker A:And like, this.
Speaker A:This is like, there's some really intense, like, situations going on, and they're fighting for their lives, and then they're still in the middle of all of this, just making jokes.
Speaker A:And I'm like, y' all okay?
Speaker B:Because I felt like I know that that's what me and my family, me and my friend, like, that is what we would do.
Speaker B:I. I know even under the pressure, under, like, that last moment, we would still be cracking jokes.
Speaker B:Yeah, right.
Speaker A:No, for real.
Speaker B:I appreciate it.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:And for anyone who is not familiar also, too, with the black, like, I said, please go watch it on Netflix.
Speaker A:But it is this, like, horror comedy.
Speaker A:It's actually based off of an SNL skit.
Speaker A:So there was this killer, like, who.
Speaker A:Who was after these.
Speaker A:These friends, like, in a.
Speaker A:Like, a cabin in the woods type situation.
Speaker A:And they.
Speaker A:They're all black.
Speaker A:So there's.
Speaker A:It's playing on, like, that stereotype of, you know, the black person always gets killed first.
Speaker A:But since it's a group of black people, they.
Speaker A:The killer is like, gives them kind of, like, this ultimatum.
Speaker A:It's like, well, you know, find us or tell me that the person who is the blackest, that's the person that we will kill.
Speaker A:So it's this.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Huh.
Speaker A:It's hilarious.
Speaker A:Like, the.
Speaker A:The SNL skit is so funny.
Speaker A:And then so what Tim Story, the director of the Blackening, did with that, he expanded that.
Speaker A:So it's really just.
Speaker A:I watched it again last night, and I'll probably watch it again tonight because it's just like one of my.
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker A:It's definitely quickly becoming one of my comfort films, and I would highly recommend because it is so funny.
Speaker A:And then when I went to go see it, when I went to go see it, it was like a theater just full of black people.
Speaker A:Like, it was just all of us, like, watching.
Speaker A:And so, like, having that experience also, too, together.
Speaker A:The Blackening, there's just.
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker A:It's very much an enjoyable experience.
Speaker A:I think there's also, like, some.
Speaker A:Yeah, you could say that there's also some lessons in that, especially when you're talking about community.
Speaker A:There's a little bit of conversation also, too.
Speaker A:Like, you know, there's someone of mixed race in there.
Speaker A:There is.
Speaker A:There's a little bit of they talk a touch.
Speaker A:A little bit on colorism.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker B:That's.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:I watched it just one time, but I'm remembering that piece of it.
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker B:There are pieces there.
Speaker B:Right, Right.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:Also, too, like, what it means to be black enough is definitely being.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:That big message.
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker B:But such an important thing to kind of talk about in that way.
Speaker B:I know, obviously, you know, it's the movie, but they're really still highlighting these conversations that go on and criticisms that people make or comments that people make.
Speaker B:All of that.
Speaker B:Yeah, Absolutely.
Speaker B:Great examples.
Speaker B:That's another good example.
Speaker B:And how nice to watch that with the theater full of, like, black folks.
Speaker B:Like, that's amazing.
Speaker B:Right?
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker B:So much fun.
Speaker A:Yes, yes.
Speaker A:Oh, thanks for that, Chris, by the way.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:So, because I think we talked about in our prep in preparation for this podcast, there was also Night of the Living Dead.
Speaker B:Yes, thank you.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:That being right.
Speaker B:Such a good one.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker B:Such a good one to talk about.
Speaker B:So when we think about even the time that that was at to have that a black male, like, character at the front, the lead, like, that was a huge thing.
Speaker B:And as a hero, you know, so it's not even that he's there and, you know, maybe, you know, kind of rein some of those stereotypes, but as the lead, as the hero, I think that's such a powerful movie to consider when we think about this.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:And all that that represents.
Speaker B:That movie has a lot kind of going on there as well.
Speaker B:But then even we when we think about the ending and how he doesn't make it.
Speaker B:Sorry, Spoiler.
Speaker A:Like, we put another spoiler warning.
Speaker A:It's fine.
Speaker B:It was a while ago.
Speaker B:It's an older movie.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:But even.
Speaker B:What.
Speaker B:What does that represent when we think about that?
Speaker B:You know, just being able to survive and then being, you know, shot by the police.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Which is what?
Speaker A:Oh, yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah, for sure.
Speaker A:Which is.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:I won't.
Speaker A:I won't say anything more about Get Out.
Speaker A:I, like, I feel like there was.
Speaker A:Well, the original.
Speaker A:Okay, more spoilers.
Speaker A:Sorry, y'.
Speaker B:All.
Speaker A:But, like, go watch get out, please.
Speaker A:But, like, get out.
Speaker A:I think at the.
Speaker A:At the end, I. I definitely like that we got an alternative ending rather than what the original ending was.
Speaker B:Gordon changed it.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Because he saw the reaction of people and he decided to switch it up.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Thank goodness.
Speaker A:He was.
Speaker A:Yeah, because I was like, as soon as you see the police car pull up, you're like, oh, my God, can we please.
Speaker A:Can we please just catch a break?
Speaker B:And the amount of energy and cheering in the theater, that was, like, one of my most favorite movies being in a movie theater.
Speaker B:Right?
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:Everyone was.
Speaker B:Was so excited.
Speaker B:Clapping, cheering, everything.
Speaker A:Oh, I was like, listen, okay, Chris, in the.
Speaker A:Get, like, in, get out.
Speaker A:He's been through so much.
Speaker A:Please just give him a break, please.
Speaker B:And then it was that friend.
Speaker A:Like, I love that it was unseriousness again.
Speaker A:He's like, yes.
Speaker A:I told you not to go in that house.
Speaker A:Like, I don't like it.
Speaker B:Again.
Speaker A:We cannot be serious, like, at all.
Speaker A:Like, dude, you're picking up your friend.
Speaker A:He's, like, bloodied and beaten, and you could not help yourself.
Speaker A:Like, just be silent in that moment.
Speaker A:Like, dude, come on.
Speaker A:Oh, my gosh.
Speaker B:But it's such a good example, right?
Speaker B:Yes, that's.
Speaker B:I understand why we.
Speaker B:We have to return to that sometimes, because it's just such a great example of a couple things.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:The social issues and just.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:There's so much in that one.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So great example.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So please watch it.
Speaker A:If you haven't seen it, please go and find.
Speaker A:Get out.
Speaker A:Watch it.
Speaker A:Watch all of Jordan Peele's movies.
Speaker A:And of course, because I'm wearing the shirt Sinners, which we have two episodes dedicated to that film because there's so much.
Speaker A:There's so much packed into that.
Speaker A:But, like, that's a recent horror film where.
Speaker A:I mean, I'm sure there are people out there who have.
Speaker A:I don't know if you talk about this or if you talk about that film in the in the course.
Speaker B:It is on the list.
Speaker A:It is on the list.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:It's such a good one.
Speaker B:But I, I'm looking forward to understanding it better as time goes on because it's so new.
Speaker B:It's like you need a couple viewings to really catch a couple of the different messages and, and hear, you know, what people are.
Speaker B:So I'm excited for it to learn and grow with that movie over time and understanding all of the messages that exist in it.
Speaker B:Yes, that's a really good example of over time.
Speaker B:I think we're going to understand even more about what's in there.
Speaker A:Oh yeah, there were for sure.
Speaker A:I mean people were giving like thought pieces.
Speaker A:There was like threads upon threads of people really breaking it down.
Speaker A:Like I said, we have two dedicated podcast episodes about sinners because there is a lot and you're right like to be able to see especially like over time, you know, all of the different things that people are still pulling from this movie or new things that people pull from the movie.
Speaker B:Well, exactly, because when we think about it, there's one thing to, you know, dissect it it in real time as it's happening.
Speaker B:But there's also that post view we think about even like the COVID time and all that was going on then we were very aware what was happening.
Speaker B:But now when we look back on it, there's a different lens of understanding.
Speaker B:So I think it happens with movies as well that we're doing all of that now.
Speaker B:But it'll be interesting to see like five, you know, 10 years what that reflection process is.
Speaker B:And that's what I love about reflection.
Speaker B:It's constantly changing with new insights.
Speaker B:As culture is moving and shifting in different ways, new understanding of the past then comes in.
Speaker B:So that's a very exciting thing just to know that we'll continue to, to see more from that movie in terms of what it was trying to tell us.
Speaker A:Absolutely.
Speaker A:So with.
Speaker A:So, so getting back to your.
Speaker A:Or really like diving a little bit more into your course or you know, how people can dive into your course because it sounds like it's, it's just.
Speaker A:This is an incredible.
Speaker A:Sounds like an incredible way to really dig more into.
Speaker A:Dig into the deeper meanings behind these films and also getting into again a lot of the commentary, you know that these films are pulling out just about real world issues.
Speaker A:So how can folks access your course?
Speaker B:Yeah, so well, it is a teachable course.
Speaker B:So it's on the teachable platform.
Speaker B:I believe you'll share the link as part of the podcast.
Speaker B:The link will be there and the link will take you to that page that will give you all of the information about it.
Speaker B:And then from there you can just hit the Enroll now button and get enrolled and get signed up.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:So that would be the best way to look out, check out the course and then you can always email me at the P R O F meaning the professor.
Speaker B:So the P r o fgmail.com.
Speaker B:so that would be the way to reach me via email.
Speaker B:So you have the course and checking out all of that information.
Speaker B:What's great about that is that you can see what the content is for each week.
Speaker B:You can see little pieces of that even before you sign up.
Speaker B:So I have like the preview so you can see what the assignments will be in some of the.
Speaker B:The different materials.
Speaker B:So you'll have a little bit of to that ahead of time to see if it's something that you would enjoy.
Speaker B:So yes, that would be the best way.
Speaker A:Awesome.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And yes, like you said, we'll also have that in the show notes, that information on how to contact you and also the link, you know, to check it out and to enroll.
Speaker A:So yeah, like I said, we'll have that in the show notes for you.
Speaker A:So just be on the lookout for that.
Speaker A:And so as we ask all of our guests, what representation in the horror genre or in general would you like to see?
Speaker A:Kathy?
Speaker B:Well, I feel like we're going to get back to Jordan Peele and also Night of the Living Dead, but I think about more complex black characters.
Speaker B:So characters that are not just surface levels or plot devices, like really complex, where you get to know them.
Speaker B:And I think it's really about the humanity.
Speaker B:So when we think about Chris from Get out, like we were seeing him so much as a person, understanding his motivation, like rooting, really feeling that.
Speaker B:So I think we need more of that.
Speaker B:More black characters that represent that.
Speaker B:Yes, we're doing better, but I don't know that we have enough examples of that.
Speaker B:And I think it's just so important for that.
Speaker B:So not the surface level, not people that are just in and then they're, you know, getting killed off.
Speaker B:But really.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Complex where we're understanding more about them as people.
Speaker B:So I think that's really where we've come a little bit.
Speaker B:But I could see a ton of room for growth when it comes to that.
Speaker B:That.
Speaker B:Yeah, Sinners being a great.
Speaker B:A more recent example of how you can do that.
Speaker B:Like that is how you do it.
Speaker B:And I think even when you mentioned the blackening, like those things that they're doing where they're kind of cracking jokes and all of that stuff.
Speaker B:Like seeing that on film is so special.
Speaker B:I can't imagine if I had access to a movie like that when I were younger and just what that would have meant for me and my growth journey, you know, as, you know, being a black person, black person in this country, just having that representation and seeing something like that, it's just so powerful.
Speaker B:So I'm thankful that the, you know, younger folks coming up have a little bit more access, but I would love to see more, more complexity in the characters.
Speaker B:I think that would be really important.
Speaker A:Absolutely.
Speaker A:And you know, for again, everyone who enrolls into this course that, that Kathy is providing the seven week course.
Speaker A:When you create your script, call us so we can get into those more complex characters.
Speaker A:Yes, yes, absolutely.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:And then as for, for you, Kathy.
Speaker A:So of course you'll be providing us with, you know, how to get in contact with you, but where, where can we find you and how can we support you?
Speaker B:Yes, well, I guess the easiest thing to do would just be to spread the word about the course.
Speaker B:Like that would be the best support that I could get, you know, so I'm just one person on this mission to spread this message in this way.
Speaker B:So even if you're not sure if you're interested, if you know people who are, you know, just sending them, you know, this pod or, you know, sending them the link to the course, I think just spreading the word about it, I think would be the best thing.
Speaker B:It's a really cool concept.
Speaker B:I'm excited to create community in this course.
Speaker B:And I should say that when you sign up, you'll have six months of access.
Speaker B:So that means that you, let's say you finish in seven weeks or you can actually finish sooner, depending on how excited and motivated you are, you will still have access to the community for six months, which is amazing.
Speaker B:So even if you're done after seven weeks, you'll still have time to hear what new people coming in are saying, thinking, and what they're creating for their script trips.
Speaker B:So I think.
Speaker B:Yeah, so, so the best way to support would just be share the information as far as you can.
Speaker B:I think that would be wonderful.
Speaker A:And then, and then, and then one more thing because you, you, you were also mentioning about the community.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So when as you're, as you're going through like each of the modules, there are other folks who are there that you can have like conversations with.
Speaker A:Did you want to like explain more about that as well and maybe like some of the things that people have been saying or like.
Speaker A:Yeah, Yep.
Speaker B:So we're actually just getting started.
Speaker B:So it has.
Speaker B:So this is kind of just like the pre presentation of the course.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:So what I imagine would go on is that each week, you know, you do the discussion questions, you watch the movie, and then there's a board for each of those things.
Speaker B:So you, you can write your answers to the discussion question in there, you can ask questions and then people can respond and they can share their own.
Speaker B:So for each of those things, there's a discussion board attached to it.
Speaker B:So you can pop in and go into each of them, create a post and just talk to people back and forth.
Speaker B:So lots of my goal is that this is discussion based.
Speaker B:So yes, you can just watch the movies, you know, maybe write the assignment and just kind of do it that way.
Speaker B:But I really see it as being community based.
Speaker B:So talking in the discussion board, I see being the crux of this course and having those conversations with each other.
Speaker B:I think that's, that's how I imagine it.
Speaker A:Wow.
Speaker A:Yeah, this sounds.
Speaker A:Like I said before we even got into the conversation, I was very much looking forward to our discussion because this sounds like just an incredible opportunity like to, to of course geek out about film because that's what we're about here at our Voices project.
Speaker A:But like also to get into conversations, to build community, to also learn.
Speaker A:And like this is a very unique thing to learn.
Speaker A:Like, you know, of course like we have like our, our core classes and everything.
Speaker A:But like as far as, and I think I was just like saying this to someone else about media literacy.
Speaker A:That's not something that is, is prioritized in school.
Speaker A:I, When I was growing up, media literacy was offered as like an elective.
Speaker A:It wasn't something that was like core.
Speaker A:And I think what we're losing a lot of, especially in this, in this day and age, we're, we're losing a lot of like understanding our media and, and really getting into the depths of like what it is that we're consuming.
Speaker A:And also like using film as a way to talk about what's really going on in the world and how movies are really reflect when they're, I'll just say when they're, when they're well made.
Speaker A:Like, like when it's, you know, because like not every, not every film is able to do that.
Speaker A:I mean making movies is hard.
Speaker A:We get it.
Speaker A:But at the same time, like again, I think, you know, people, it's, it's hard to like talk about Sometimes it's hard to talk about, like, the deeper issues, but I think having something like a film.
Speaker A:Right, because people, you know, there's.
Speaker A:There's a lot of people who.
Speaker A:Who love film.
Speaker A:And so to be able to have these conversations and start.
Speaker A:Start right at film, I think.
Speaker A:I think film provides a very good gateway into talking about these deep, deeper issues without it feeling like, you know, someone's, like, preaching at you, you know, that's exactly it.
Speaker B:Right, right.
Speaker B:I think people feel more comfortable looking at it that way, and then once they've started that thought process, then hopefully can take that and move further.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:But I know it can kind of hit people hard.
Speaker B:You talk about class, you talk about consumerism, things like that, and people feel like people's brain shut off.
Speaker B:But when you add the horror piece to it, oh, okay, let's think about this.
Speaker B:But then my hope is that translates to looking at the world in the same way that media courses would do, you know, so you take a course like that and you start to look at things a little bit differently, analyze things, you know, use critical, you know, thinking.
Speaker B:All of that hope is that this starts the conversation, but then there's more to come and people can apply this knowledge into their.
Speaker B:Their.
Speaker B:Their lives.
Speaker A:Absolutely.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:Critical thinking is something that is very.
Speaker A:Is very much needed.
Speaker A:And so, yeah, I would encourage anyone who is watching this, if you're watching this on YouTube, first of all, hit that subscribe button.
Speaker A:Hit it and.
Speaker A:Or if you're listening also, please subscribe.
Speaker A:But, you know, if you're really feeling encouraged by this, if it's something that you want to, you know, get into, especially as a film fan, as a horror film fan, like, I would absolutely say definitely sign up for this course and then also encourage other people to sign up.
Speaker A:Because.
Speaker A:Because, like I said, this is a very.
Speaker A:I feel as though it's a very great opportunity, you know, to dig into something that is very.
Speaker A:Is very beneficial.
Speaker A:You know, whether.
Speaker A:Whether it's just like, being able to talk about films, like, in this way, or, again, just being able to talk about, like, deeper issues again, there's a lot going on in our political climate.
Speaker A:Hello.
Speaker A:So to be able to talk about this and for it not to feel.
Speaker A:I mean, it all feels heavy.
Speaker A:But at the same time, I think, like I was saying before, talking about film is a great.
Speaker A:Is a great kind of, like, bridge.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:To be able to talk about something that's like, you know, sometimes, you know, oftentimes we use films as, like, escape escapism, which is Nice.
Speaker A:But then to be able to then take that bridge, like the bridge from escapism into talking about the.
Speaker A:Those deeper issues, I think is a very great.
Speaker B:Because we're feeling tired and overwhelmed, what's going on, but we don't want to not have the conversation.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:So you're absolutely right.
Speaker B:And we use film to kind of, you know, de.
Speaker B:Stress and kind of help us to feel better.
Speaker B:So it's.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:So it's a nice way to be able to do that, to still have the conversations, but do it in a way that doesn't feel like, oh, just more.
Speaker B:More of these things that are going on.
Speaker B:So that's my hope.
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker B:As a therapist, I don't want to stress anybody.
Speaker B:It's not my goal.
Speaker B:But I also know that these critical conversations do.
Speaker B:To happen.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So creating a space for that that can take place.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:I think that's.
Speaker B:That's the key.
Speaker A:Absolutely.
Speaker A:Maybe.
Speaker A:Maybe that's why I was trying to explain to somebody why a movie like Annihilation is one of my comfort films.
Speaker A:Yeah, I know.
Speaker A:I'm like, they were like, how?
Speaker A:And I'm like, I. I don't know.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:Maybe.
Speaker A:Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker A:I. I don't really have an explanation for that one.
Speaker A:But I don't know, maybe what we talked about, because there, I feel like there's.
Speaker A:I don't.
Speaker A:I don't necessarily know if there's anything deeper in Annihilation.
Speaker A:Maybe that's something we can discuss on the podcast.
Speaker A:Our next.
Speaker A:Our next film, Annihilation.
Speaker A:Let's talk about it.
Speaker A:But Kathy, I. I really do appreciate you taking the time to come out and like, talk to us about, you know, about your.
Speaker A:Your course again, everyone, it's called Screams and Social Justice.
Speaker A:Analyzing the politics of horror.
Speaker A:Again, this will be in the show notes, so if you want to check that out and enroll and find out more information about it, that will be there.
Speaker A:Again, thank you, Kathy, for sharing your knowledge and agreeing to be a guest on the podcast today for our listeners and viewers.
Speaker A:We absolutely thank you so much for your support of our Voice Voices project and the Our Voice and the Representation in Cinema podcast.
Speaker A:You can find us on YouTube, Facebook, Instagram, tick Tock, Blue sky, and Also on our rvoicesproject.com for more information as well on what we do.
Speaker A:You can sign up for our newsletter there to be the first to get notifications about the podcast episodes and new projects.
Speaker A:Again, if you are watching on YouTube, I can't say it Enough, enough.
Speaker A:Hit that subscribe button.
Speaker A:Share this Comment all the things you can listen to this podcast and others under Representations in Cinema on any of the platforms, anywhere you you listen or watch your favorite podcasts.
Speaker A:Because of course, again, like I said at the top of this episode, we are your favorite podcast.
Speaker A:This has been Jackie McGriff, your host for this episode of Representation in Cinema.
Speaker A:As always, thank you so much for listening.
Speaker B:Thanks everyone.
Speaker A:This has been a presentation of the Lunchboard Podcast Network.
Speaker A:Also, if you enjoyed Dwayne Jones in Night of the Living Dead, check him out in Ganja and Hess, a tremendous vampire movie from the early seventies.
